POLL: U.S. Response To Mid-East Protests?

Walt September 17, 2012 at 12:17 pm

Are you blind or just thick headed, read the opposing views instead of just throwing your snarky remarks everywhere. Our UN ambassador comes out and says publicly that the reason for the Libya assassinations was the silly video while at the same time the new Libyan government (that obama put in power by committing US troops toward the defeat of kaddaffi) is telling the world it was a planned al quada assault. It appears to me and many others that the US President is on the sidelines, adrift in the tide unaware of what is happening, with no coordination or plan. He looks like a buffoon on the world stage and owes the American people as well our allies throughout the world an explanation of the actual events and a commitment to our resolve instead of the lies, deflections and mismanagement that oozes out of the WH everyday.

Dan Seidel September 17, 2012 at 12:31 pm

Hey Walt, methinks loose cannon is a paid MObama zombie troll - remember OWS has reared it's Soros head again. ignore the instigator. he/she/it discusses nothing and adds even less.

GC September 17, 2012 at 01:07 pm

Bjorn says the sky is colorless. Touché! As clever and pithy as that may sound, it illustrates the problem: Most of us see the world for what it is by the empirical evidence around us. Others try and obscure the facts by arguing semantics. Now, as frustrating as that may be; we, as adults, can go on point and counter-point, and it may seem harmless. But the real danger is that by twisting the truth you create confusion and despair, especially for the next generation. They are listening, and are learning that there is nothing to believe in, because of sentiments like Bjorn’s (even if it is without malicious intent). As far as my having a “monopoly” or “interpreting” the founders, it is you Mr.: “the Sky is not blue it is colorless” that is interpreting things for your own convenience. Limited, enumerated powers; they spelled it out, simply and plainly! One doesn’t need to interpret the truth.

GC September 17, 2012 at 01:21 pm

Issay, I don’t have to “decide” what the founder’s vision was; it is spelled it out in the constitution and the bill of rights. The constitution is NOT a living document! It is not subject to interpretation! You touch on the problem though; amendments to the constitution can be made with a two-thirds majority in both houses of the legislature. Not by presidential fiat or judicial activism. Yes it is (to paraphrase you) everybody’s America, but that does not give you the right to twist the Law of the Land to fit your personal view. Yes this is a free country; yes it is open to all, but the United States of America has its own identity, what you describe is anarchy. You cannot use the freedoms this nation affords us as a tool to destroy it.

Bjorn Olsson September 17, 2012 at 04:20 pm

GC, although my comment on the colorless sky was not intended as such, it actually seems to prove my point rather well. The sky sure looks blue, but the truth is it's actually not. It may seem to you that government is always less efficient than private enterprise, but when confronted with the fact-based example of Medicare vs the insurance industry, you refuse to see it. "The sky looks blue to me and therefore it is, and anyone who disagrees is misguided at best, stupid or malicious at worst." I happen to believe facts counteract the confusion and despair you worry about. The founders believed a lot of thing, including that slavery was an acceptable practice. Society evolved, wanted different rules, and so the constitution was amended. The founders were also mostly opposed to standing armies, do you then agree we should dismantle the armed forces? Or did the world change and create different needs than in 1776?

R. Nite September 17, 2012 at 04:22 pm

Hillary needs to resign now! Obama and Hillary knowingly put these people in harms way without protection. A attack on our embassy is an attact on America.

GC September 17, 2012 at 05:49 pm

Bjorn, earlier you stated that you are a “non-American”. I’m not sure exactly what you mean by that. I’m going to take the meaning as: you are not a U.S. citizen. In and of itself, that doesn’t matter all that much, but it speaks to your perspective. If I’m on the earth and look at the sky, it’s blue. If you are looking at the earth from space, it’s colorless. So, if you’re not a citizen or (just as importantly) not a tax-payer, your take on what is happening in this country doesn’t match the truths that we on the ground know. Regrettably, that takes you down the wrong path. The media has done much to help cause this misperception, to advance the progressive agenda. Medicare rigs the game, causes distortions and price dislocations; and you call that efficient (more sky is blue stuff there)! As far as “The founders believed… that slavery was an acceptable practice”; ACK! The Declaration of Independence and the Constitution helped end slavery! The moment it was ratified this country was on a path to civil war and slavery (putting an end to it) was a major reason why! Yes, it was almost 100 years later, but twitter wasn’t invented yet. Also, it was a need to raise a Navy, to protect our merchant ships from the British blockade after the revolution, that necessitated the confederation adopt the Constitution. They were protecting their interests, see any similarities to today? Sadly, the world hasn’t changed all that much.

ahofer September 17, 2012 at 05:55 pm

Ok, you are really an idiot tool of the extreme right wing conspiracy nuts. This picture shows sympathetic Libyan civilians trying to carry Ambassador Stevens to a hospital, as attested by his colleagues who witnessed it. A large number of locals tried to rescue him from the burning building and take him to safety. Many other Libyan civilians who considered him a friend to their country were later seen at a "we're sorry, America" demonstration, with expressions of grief and sorrow. The attack was carried out by a small minority, and may have been preplanned to use the anti-muslim video as an excuse and cover story.

Francis T McVetty September 17, 2012 at 07:10 pm

Walt, Like that is going to happen. He can't even admit that we have an economic problem and you think he will admit we have a world perception problem? The movie is a straw man. Over 90% of those in the Arab countries have a problem with understanding electricity, so how many do you think can even get on the internet to see this obscure movie?

BR Cannon September 17, 2012 at 07:11 pm

When you opine something that warrants more than "snarky", you'll get it.

Brian September 17, 2012 at 07:14 pm

I voted for diplomacy because we tried violence in Iraq and Afghanistan and they were utter disasters. I think anybody who is so willing to send US troops to die in foreign lands should volunteer to go there. I'm not a big fan of chickenhawks, and it seems like they are everywhere.

Brian September 17, 2012 at 07:17 pm

Please give me an example of this "apologist" attitude you speak of. Do you mean Obama not swaggering around like a faux tough guy and sending other people to fight wars to make up for his own draft-dodging inadequacies? I don't really think that is apologist.

Francis T McVetty September 17, 2012 at 07:18 pm

Bjorn, Obviously your internet search engine is NOT working or at best you don't know how to use it. <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuXxtg4M_z8> He is one from a church pastor on the same subject.<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQz2naHi910> So when you write that "what do you base that on, because out here in my world, there is nothing that supports that statement." you certainly haven't tried to look!

Bjorn Olsson September 17, 2012 at 07:57 pm

Not the way you look. You look only for information that supports your preconceived notion. I can recite the same call to prayer, I am not religious but I still now the basic language in them. My reciting those lines will not make me a muslim, no matter what some youtube voice says some mullah says. Not that I would care if Obama was a muslim, hindu or mormon, but I really don't see any signs of him being one. If anything, I would guess the family is not terribly religious at all, but I really don't know. That Obama would be a secret muslim with a secret plan to ruin the country is so patently moronic, but still, somehow, this narrative has taken hold. Let's pretend this was true. Does that mean his whole staff is in on it too? His cabinet, all secret muslims? Or just fooled completely by this one man with a plan? It's just to bottomlessly stupid, sorry.

Walden Macnair September 17, 2012 at 08:10 pm

Okay, so yes, he did recall the first few lines for the Muslim call to prayer in 2007 in an interview with the NY Times. What exactly does that prove, or more importantly, what are you inferring from that?
Why do you believe that intelligent people who are aware and educated in other cultures are somehow Un-American? Would you prefer George W come back? There was a man who couldn't order off a Chinese Menu without help.

Francis T McVetty September 17, 2012 at 08:15 pm

Walden, at least I knew who he was. Someone that we knew all about. Not spending millions of dollars on lawyers to hide and seal ALL his records. We didn't have to wait years to see his birth certificate. We didn't even have to see it, we all knew he was born in the USA.

Francis T McVetty September 17, 2012 at 08:17 pm

Bjorn, by the way what better source would you want if NOT the actual words being spoken by that person? Are you saying he didn't say that?

Bjorn Olsson September 17, 2012 at 08:28 pm

The whole birther movement was based on nothing. They eventually forced the president to prove that he was who he said he was, and it turned out he was. Imagine that. (Naturally, no evidence will convince the hard core birthers anyway) Maybe if George Bush had been a different color or carried a strange foreign sounding name, he would have had the same people connecting their imaginary dots and ranting on conspiracy theory blogs, no?

Bjorn Olsson September 17, 2012 at 08:29 pm

No I won't. What I will say is that it doesn't mean he is a secret muslim, only that he is more familiar with Islam than most candidates, which is hardly a drawback.

Walt September 17, 2012 at 08:34 pm

Like I care.

Walden Macnair September 17, 2012 at 09:03 pm

Francis, We've covered the sealed records turf before but for the sake of Republicans who seem to have trouble understanding, I'll go through it one more time. His college records aren't sealed, nor are mine for that matter. However, federal law prohibits the college from disclosing my records without my written permission. Same goes for Obama. Even George W's records were sealed but unfortunately were stolen and that's how they got released.
All these allegations from the right side of the aisle are just a way of saying that he's not one of us, he's different, etc, etc. That's why they say he's a Muslim, No he's a radical Baptist, No he wasn't born here, he was born in Kenya and on and on it goes. People outside your little world sometimes have to learn other cultures. I was in a job where I needed to understand Japanese culture in order to work effectively. Does that make me Japanese? Come on, you're better than that. Debate the issues, not the, "he's not one of us" crap.

SRT September 17, 2012 at 09:12 pm

Francis,
Do you know that Morsi's government was complicit in these attacks? Where do you get your intel? Send me the link. And by the way, we deal with devil's all the time, of course when we deal with them we think of them as saints. The Rumsfeld eagerly shaking Saddam Husseins hand.

SRT September 17, 2012 at 09:16 pm

"The arab spring was just a huge step foward toward a war we will be afraid to fight for politically correct reasons. "
Yeah, that people wanting democracy is a tricky thing, don't want to encourage that to much. What would you have preferred that people just remain repressed.

Francis T McVetty September 17, 2012 at 10:06 pm

Issy, the key is to have our own source of oil and gas. Right here in north America. We don't need Hugo's oil!!! We don't need oil from the middle east. They just use their oil as tools to tweek us. When we are independent than we can tell them all to SCREW themselves! We can't do that right now because we are limited by the Obama administration from drilling for our own oil ON GOVERMNET lands right now. That will hopefully change in 2013!When they have No leverage over us things might be a little different in our relationships.

Heather Pollock September 17, 2012 at 10:36 pm

Bjorn...
You really believe we have that much influence there? You are fooled. A good many of those nations could own us. And it is not just religion...it is also our interference IN their countries, our forcing OUR way of life on them... Imagine them coming here and doing this to us...how do you think we would feel?

Bjorn Olsson September 17, 2012 at 10:48 pm

Not sure what you mean by "those nations could own us." It is very likely true that part of the animosity in say, Egypt, comes from the US supporting Mubarak for so long. But a lot of it is rooted in the support for Israel too. You can't expect some kind of direct response, as in "we paid you a million dollars, now do exactly what we say," but being at the table gives you more than if you're not.

J. Cattano September 18, 2012 at 12:40 am

You sound so ridiculous McVetty... still blaming everything on the "black" man. Come on - this is getting soooo old.

Bjorn Olsson September 18, 2012 at 03:36 am

Francis, I can't really say that I understand electricity or the internet myself, but I know how to use both of them, just now I went to check on that condescending remark, for instance, and learned that there are 31 million internet users in Egypt, just shy of 40% of the population. I will assume they have electricity as well. A couple of them probably even know how to get you YouTube.

John Anderson September 18, 2012 at 12:36 pm

So Bjorn, why doesn't he exercise some of his expertise?
Why are people burning images of him? Seems like no matter what he does or doesn't do, you will love him always...that's your choice. I'm waiting for Obama to take to the microphone (and teleprompter of course) and give a 40 minute speech in Arabic.

Bjorn Olsson September 18, 2012 at 01:05 pm

John, I don't think I am particularly in love with Obama, as you put it. I have a problem with the extreme nut case narratives (Obama is a secret socialist muslim, hellbent on destroying the country, bla bla bla) since they make it almost impossible to have an adult conversation about the actual man in the White House, rather than the imaginary president in Eastwood's chair.